Author Topic: Mob Rules vs. Born Again  (Read 2019 times)

HK

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Mob Rules vs. Born Again
« on: May 05, 2014, 10:00:48 PM »
15 years ago, this would have been hands down Mob Rules.  Clearly I was an idiot back then. 

Today (and I suspect until the day I die), it's Born Again.  Once you strip away all the silly imagery and campy elements (of which there are many) of Born Again, it's just flat out better than Mob Rules.  Mob Rules is a lumbering wagon that gets stuck in ruts for long spells.  When you throw in "The Fallen", it's not even close for me anymore.  Mob Rules is a really good album.  Born Again is great. 

Iommi truly never played better than on Born Again.  I've said it a thousand times, but he just took his playing to a different level on this one.

Geezer is Geezer.  You can never go wrong there.

Ward is sooo much better than Stone Hands it's almost sad.  Heaven and Hell and Born Again structurally don't give Ward a lot of breathing room, but what he does in that confined space is hypnotic.  It's very subtle.  He's such an elegant drummer.  The quirky beats and fills, the little hops and stutters ----- it's back in the mix on Born Again.  I find something new in "Keep It Warm" and "Born Again" every time I listen to them.  It's almost more impressive than something like Volume 4 (where he's given expansive room to work).  He's playing in a phone booth on Born Again.   Mob Rules just doesn't have any of that.   Ward is a huge reason for the lack of swing and texture on Mob Rules.

Gillan added something totally different to the mix than Dio.  Dio is a metal singer.  Sabbath isn't really a metal band.  Gillan is a completely different animal.  I don't necessarily think he's the better singer, but he brought something to the mix that the band was sorely needing.  Although they were trying to make an 80's metal album, Gillan's 70's rock leanings and wink-and-nod attitude still find a way to shine through.   I really wish this lineup could've stayed together for a few albums. 

So, anyway, stop being stupid.  Demote Mob Rules and promote Born Again.  Send some hate mail to Stone Hands. 

artcinco

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Re: Mob Rules vs. Born Again
« Reply #1 on: May 06, 2014, 11:26:27 AM »
Born Again is the last truly interesting Sabbath album. It became metal by numbers after that. The Devil You Know and 13 are "stick to the formula."

Ward=interesting.

What would Mob have been like with Bill? Devil or 13 for that matter? If the sabs do another one get Bill and throw out the formula.

Godless Fur Trapper

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Re: Mob Rules vs. Born Again
« Reply #2 on: May 07, 2014, 07:23:23 PM »
I dig Born Again, but it suffers from that weird-ass production.  And Mob Rules has "Sign Of The Southern Cross," which is one of the best Sabbath songs of all time.  I wish they had done at least one more album with Gillan though, and had paid more attention to the production.  I dig the first album with Martin, there was still gas in the Iommi tank, but then it goes into heavy metal shit pit mode.  So, Mob Rules.  And that's that.

sabbatology

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Re: Mob Rules vs. Born Again
« Reply #3 on: May 07, 2014, 09:39:34 PM »
Sign of the Southern Cross > E5150 > Mob Rules ... greatest mini-epic-plod-to-rocker trilogy of all time
Stonehenge > Disturbing the Priest > The Dark > Zero the Hero ... greatest mini-epic-evil-rocker quadrilogy of all time

There, it is said.

HK

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Re: Mob Rules vs. Born Again
« Reply #4 on: May 07, 2014, 09:48:32 PM »
I dig Born Again, but it suffers from that weird-ass production.  And Mob Rules has "Sign Of The Southern Cross," which is one of the best Sabbath songs of all time.  I wish they had done at least one more album with Gillan though, and had paid more attention to the production.  I dig the first album with Martin, there was still gas in the Iommi tank, but then it goes into heavy metal shit pit mode.  So, Mob Rules.  And that's that.

I thank God for the busted cone in the studio speaker that Iommi blames the weird sound on.  His guitar tone was never so distinct before or after Born Again.  I have to believe that was part of the equation.  His guitar tone on Born Again is absolutely fucking sick.  I once described it as being like velvet razor wire and it's a pretty apt description.  If the weird ass production is the mother of that baby, I'll take it.   

HK

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Re: Mob Rules vs. Born Again
« Reply #5 on: May 07, 2014, 09:51:06 PM »
Sign of the Southern Cross > E5150 > Mob Rules ... greatest mini-epic-plod-to-rocker trilogy of all time
Stonehenge > Disturbing the Priest > The Dark > Zero the Hero ... greatest mini-epic-evil-rocker quadrilogy of all time

There, it is said.

B-R-O-N-G!!!!!!!!!!!  Digital Bitch, Born Again, Hot Line, Keep It Warm ---- this is where the magic happens. 

Am I the only one around here who gives a shit about the rules?

Godless Fur Trapper

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Re: Mob Rules vs. Born Again
« Reply #6 on: May 08, 2014, 03:38:03 PM »
Mark it zero, Smokey.

Supernaut

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Re: Mob Rules vs. Born Again
« Reply #7 on: May 19, 2014, 06:37:49 PM »
I think all that humidity down there has pruned your brain, I do agree with the summation of Iommi's freaked out guitar tone and his, what seems like, heavily  cocaine fueled solos, but really it's just a building on what he did on MR, Iommi shreds MR to pieces. As far as Vinne the Ham Fisted wonder, his high water marks for drumming were MR and Holy Diver, now this is not to say he even comes close to Mr.Ward, but he does a great job. I think as an album opener Turn Up the Night sleighs Trashed hands down. Voodoo is a great riff with a great solo, the rest of the album is just a skull buster, Falling off the Edge.... IMO is one of the best vocal tracks Dio ever set to tape. if MR has one weak link it's Slippin Away, I like the song but it always seemed out of place on that album.The outro solo on Over and Over is freakin mind blowing.

I love Born Again, I was on board with that album when it came out and played the grooves off the album and wore out many a cassette copy. But for me while I like Iommi's playing, hell I even liked the original production, but really that album has 4 great songs , Trashed, Zero the Hero, Born Again and Disturbing the Priest{ this tune is in my top ten all time faves} while the playing on tracks like Ditigal Bitch, Hotline, Keep it warm are great I think those riffs were a bit "pedestrian" from the likes of Mr. Iommi,  MR is the stronger album and IMO has stood the test of time better than BA, when really it's apples to apples in the long run as both albums are their own beasts.

So in a perfect world here's what I'd like to see, We had a cap on the Dio era{ well, with his passing} with the Devil you Know, an album I was luke warm to for a while but the first 8 tracks on that album are monstrous,  with stand outs being Fear, Bible Black, Atom & Evil and one of the heaviest guitar Riffs and best tracks that era ever produced Follow the Tears. I think a worthy end to that line up after the disastrous Dehumanizer album.  We got "13" an album I truly dig and was very surprised and impressed with it's quality, even the "extra" tracks were all really good. So to really put the corner stone in a brilliant career they should reunite the BA line up and record a new album... when that happens all the players should get together and burn all the Master Tapes from the Martin era  and really end things on a great note.... ya.... in a perfect world..........     

sabbatology

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Re: Mob Rules vs. Born Again
« Reply #8 on: May 26, 2014, 03:54:27 PM »
Wow, you truly read my mind and transcribed it.  Uncanny.